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  #16  
Old 10-27-2002, 02:33 PM
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aktiondan aktiondan is offline
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Ryan, NICE list of motors. You haven't spared any expense either, getting the big brand names. The R.I.P and critical condition statements had me LOL'ing quite a bit. Too funny. Come to think of it, my 380 right now is in critical condition. How hard can it be to make a 380 sized motor up to par with 540 standards? Mondo if you click on my www, you'll see plenty of pics on sticking a 380 in a Micro. The 300 motor mount plate is what I use with my 380. You have to widen the center hole and the top screw hole is all. It fits right in. Proportionally speaking a 380 in a 1:18 scale is WAY more comparable to a 540 in a 1:10 scale. IMO.

Dude, I can't believe the old Grasshopper had a 380 motor in it?? What a trip. Takes me back to when every personI knew owned The Frog and I was still driving around my Radio Shack Audio Quattro. Even with that piece of junk I modded the chassis to accepts a couple extra cells and had that little sucker flying, till it fried of course. I honestly want to try a couple of these other motors but all my RC energy as well as money is being put to another cause...I've turned over to the Dark Side and am getting a T-Maxx. I'm sorry guys. I'm still 100% Micro, but I gotta have something I can pound on in the all this awesome desert dirt which makes up 90% of Arizona. But you guys definitely let me know what you come up with. I can post pics and ideas from anyone on my site if you'd like. It's a free-for-all anyway.

-Dan
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  #17  
Old 10-27-2002, 07:27 PM
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aktiondan aktiondan is offline
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Dude, I went through half a pack tonight and man this setup rocks! The car is blazingly fast. It flies all the way up my street in only a few seconds and is already nearly out of sight. I hit one of my curbs, which look like little 6" ramps and flew about 10 feet in the air and then rolled head over heals for another several feet before stopping in a pile of rocks. It came out unscathed. I wish I got that on video! You guys wouldn't even believe it. I'm really beginning to like this setup more and more. I'll try and get some video of it with my digicam, which doesn't do the best video, but it'll at least give you an idea of how fast this goes. Put it this way, it's faster than in any video you see on my site. I'm going to search around and see if there aren't a few other 380 motors out there that maybe have ball bearings, or some specs for them available. Later.

-Dan

Attached is a pic that shows fairly well the Speed 300 motor plate and the copper tubing insert as well as my modified rear deck so all this would fit in a 140mm wheelbase.
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File Type: jpg motor_plate_380.jpg (103.9 KB, 185 views)
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  #18  
Old 10-28-2002, 05:56 AM
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Mondo Mondo is offline
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380 Micro

Dan,

Sounds like fun. Now I'll be phoning my LHS to see if they can dig out a 380 sized motor for me
Thanks for the pics of the motor plate, that clears things up a lot.
I can't wait to see another one of your videos, but this time I (and many others) want to see the 380 powered Micro in action
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  #19  
Old 10-30-2002, 01:25 PM
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RyMicroRS4 RyMicroRS4 is offline
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Talking 380, 20T and 8 cell......WOAH!!!

Well I just ran it in front of my house just a couple minutes to go.
All I can say is ................WOAH!!!!

The 20T is the ticket!!!
My 8 cell pack pulled a 12.0V charge this morning.

I am also only running it in Drag Mode. You know....RWD only, no belt, no front diff, Sierra body, narrow setting mediums on front and Homemade foam tires and full wide setting on rear.

Aktiondan......Thanks for all the info. My car is very fast!!

I just need to locate someone with a RTR Nitro 3 and the stock 15fe on a single speed. I think I can smoke it. Maybe I'll reassemble mine. Hmmmm....

If my car is still in one piece...tonight, i'll put all the accessories back in and "try" to dial it in to go around a track.
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  #20  
Old 10-30-2002, 02:07 PM
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aktiondan aktiondan is offline
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SWEET! So you decided to go with a 20T instead of something larger? Smart move I think. I'm getting a new Speed 400 sometime soon and I think I'll move up to a 21T but I don't dare go much bigger. Right now I'm figuring out how to mod my MC230 to handle 10 cells and I think I have may have a solution. I gotta get 12V to this motor and an ESC as large as this one should be able to handle the cells because every airplane ESC that is 1/4 the size does it with no problems. I wrote to Futaba and asked them to send me a schematic of the ESC and they gratiously declined. They also said they could not provide me any information on how to "alter" the ESC to handle more cells. I'll figure it out though.

I'm glad you tried it out and you like the setup. I think the trick now will be choosing the absolute perfect motor (see my site for an updated list of 380 motors, it's getting long) and then choosing the right number cells and the right size pinion to go along with. There are so many combinations, it makes my head spin!

-Dan
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  #21  
Old 10-30-2002, 04:11 PM
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Miha Holc Miha Holc is offline
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Dan, looking at your 380 motor table I noticed the 4.8 V low rpm numbers and big current draw. Of course the 6x3 prop is overload!

I suggest you to just swap your current 400 motor with 4.8V race, you'll be plenty surprised, just be little conservative with gearing at first

In the boats 400 4.8 V race can be 50 % faster than 400 6V but in cars where torque is not so important 4.8 V and let's say 8 cells should push micro to warp speed!
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  #22  
Old 10-30-2002, 06:35 PM
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RyMicroRS4 RyMicroRS4 is offline
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Talking I broke something.

Well I finally broke something. I ended up reinstalling all the parts I took out to try to dial it in, but that ended. Out of all the stock plastic parts I have...I ended up snapping one of my alloy dogbones!!

Dan,
20T seems to be perfect. Has great acceleration and plenty of top speed. This setup should do very well on a 10th scale track. I think I'm gonna try out the Speed 400 Race 4.8V. That looks very promising!

Yes...there is too many motor setups to experiment with. I think that is what keeps me so interested in Micros. My MC230 is still alive, even with the 12V charges I've been pulling.
Once I get my Race 20 esc...I'll try 10 cells.

-Ryan
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M18-blown motor and stripped servo.
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Wishlist: Losi Mini T, Kyosho Mini Z, the AktionRC 540 conversion set, and a few packs from Blindbatts.

Last edited by RyMicroRS4; 10-30-2002 at 06:38 PM.
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  #23  
Old 10-30-2002, 06:51 PM
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aktiondan aktiondan is offline
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You snapped an alloy dogbone??!! No way. That is so awesome. I am planning on getting a new motor this week. The one I'm running now is the cheapest of the group. But has held up fine so far through a number of runs. Which is more than I can say for any of the other motors I've run. I like the current draw of both the 400 4.8V race and the Rocket 400 6V. Either motor may be the fastest of the lot. I don't think anyone really expected these motors to ever be suited for RC cars, so we'll have to be pioneers in determining which motor is really the best suited for this "unique" application. Ryan man, you crack me up. So you think I can run 10 cells to my MC230 no probs? That'd be rad. I'm going to do a 150mm conversion and get some new tires, rims, bulkhead parts tree, and what-nots and build my car back up from scratch with the Speed 400 and 10 cells in mind. I can't even fathom what it might be capable of....

-Dan
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  #24  
Old 10-31-2002, 01:15 AM
djslik djslik is offline
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I just had a quick question...I went to the dan marx website and I tried out the 1/8" copper tubing to fit my 19 tooth pinion over the speed 380 motor shaft, but there is a tiny bit of slipping that occurs when i put full throttle on the motor meaning the pinoin doesn't turn the diff and the car doesn't go...what did you guys do to keep the tubing from slipping or do i need to get different tubing, it's the same tubing pictured somewhere else in this thread...thanks...oh and i did try out a 22 tooth pinion when the tubing wasn't slipping so much and it wore out the batteries fast and the motor got way too hot...and it was slow off the line...I think the 20 tooth is probably getting close to optimal size.
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  #25  
Old 10-31-2002, 10:19 AM
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RyMicroRS4 RyMicroRS4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by aktiondan
You snapped an alloy dogbone??!! No way. That is so awesome. I am planning on getting a new motor this week. The one I'm running now is the cheapest of the group. But has held up fine so far through a number of runs. Which is more than I can say for any of the other motors I've run. I like the current draw of both the 400 4.8V race and the Rocket 400 6V. Either motor may be the fastest of the lot. I don't think anyone really expected these motors to ever be suited for RC cars, so we'll have to be pioneers in determining which motor is really the best suited for this "unique" application. Ryan man, you crack me up. So you think I can run 10 cells to my MC230 no probs? That'd be rad. I'm going to do a 150mm conversion and get some new tires, rims, bulkhead parts tree, and what-nots and build my car back up from scratch with the Speed 400 and 10 cells in mind. I can't even fathom what it might be capable of....

-Dan

Dan,
10 cells on MC230 should be roast-city! Heck, we should already be cooking it with 8 cells. If you are willing to try it out...thumbs up to you and a couple knocks on wood for luck.

I couldn't believe I snapped the dogbone either. I was seriously shocked! I'll have a picture of the injury up soon. I guess it's one of those things I had to expect. I'll buy a new set in a couple hours.

Dan, which motor are you going to try first? I have alittle idea. Since we're self promoted "pioneers" aka nut-cases on trying all these motor setup...how about you setup the rocket 400 6V and I'll do the Speed 400 Race 4.8V? It'll save some time and money. All we got to do is report back to home base(forum).
My 400 race should be here very soon.

I took my car to my LHS and they just looked at me crazy!! It was hilarious!!
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M18-blown motor and stripped servo.
MRS4- running once again.

Wishlist: Losi Mini T, Kyosho Mini Z, the AktionRC 540 conversion set, and a few packs from Blindbatts.
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  #26  
Old 10-31-2002, 10:27 AM
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RyMicroRS4 RyMicroRS4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by djslik
I just had a quick question...I went to the dan marx website and I tried out the 1/8" copper tubing to fit my 19 tooth pinion over the speed 380 motor shaft, but there is a tiny bit of slipping that occurs when i put full throttle on the motor meaning the pinoin doesn't turn the diff and the car doesn't go...what did you guys do to keep the tubing from slipping or do i need to get different tubing, it's the same tubing pictured somewhere else in this thread...thanks...oh and i did try out a 22 tooth pinion when the tubing wasn't slipping so much and it wore out the batteries fast and the motor got way too hot...and it was slow off the line...I think the 20 tooth is probably getting close to optimal size.
Here's a easy solution for that:
-Add some CA glue and/or grind a flat spot on the motor shaft. Then with a plier...crimp the copper tubing to the shaft, so it will gain the flat spot on the tubing. Lock the pinion down and it should hold.

We think 21T is max size pinion to run on this setup. 20T is perfect. 22T or more might work well if you run 10 cells.
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M18-blown motor and stripped servo.
MRS4- running once again.

Wishlist: Losi Mini T, Kyosho Mini Z, the AktionRC 540 conversion set, and a few packs from Blindbatts.
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  #27  
Old 10-31-2002, 12:24 PM
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aktiondan aktiondan is offline
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That's funny you mention that, b/c I was totally leaning towards trying out the Speed 400 6V first. Mainly because I feel that running 9.6V should be perfect (no need to try 10 cells) and I'll still get the added benefit of 17 amps. Wanna know what's kinda funny? I was looking at the specs for the TO280BB and you know what current that thing pulls? 1.4 amps! That's like this small compared to the massive power of these 400 motors.

So what I don't mention on the site is how I get the pinion and the shaft to mate in perfect harmony. But I basically do what Ryan said. Grind a small flat spot on the shaft and don't be afraid to use a drop of CA as well. The tubing should fit really snug inside the pinion, but it will slip easily onto the motor shaft. I drilled a small hole in top of the tube so the set screw would fit all the way through allowing it to tighten up against the flat spot on the shaft. So all that along with the CA and it stays on their snug as a bug.

Dude evertime I walk into my LHS the guy just goes, "Oh great, what you trying to do this time?" Cuz I'm always buying random parts made for any other cars/airplanes but my Micro (b/c they carry like 2 Micro parts). I think they should be used to it by now.

I've been emailing another Micro fan who I don't know if he's on this forum or not but he's also caught the 380 craze. So I want to see some pics of people's setups!

-Dan
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  #28  
Old 10-31-2002, 01:03 PM
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Miha Holc Miha Holc is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by aktiondan
That's funny you mention that, b/c I was totally leaning towards trying out the Speed 400 6V first. Mainly because I feel that running 9.6V should be perfect (no need to try 10 cells) and I'll still get the added benefit of 17 amps. Wanna know what's kinda funny? I was looking at the specs for the TO280BB and you know what current that thing pulls? 1.4 amps! That's like this small compared to the massive power of these 400 motors.

Ease down Dan. Don't look at those 17 amps this way. Take a good look on the 380 motor table you have on your hopup site.

Example:

You have listed Amps and nom. voltage. This gives you P = I * U ; W power in. You have also listed Watts out.

Speed 400 7.2 V , 59.5 % eff @ 7 amps, 8.4 V

Speed 400 6 V , 60.7 % eff @ 8 amps, 7.2 V

Speed 400 4.8 V race, 49 % eff @ 17 amps, 6 V

Rocket 400 6 V, 46 % eff @ 17 amps, 7.2 V


My comment: You'll never see 17 amps in a micro except for very first mili sec on the start. Then the amp draw goes very fast down.

Furthermore:
Download program called Motocalc @ www.motocalc.com . It is intended for airplanes but what you need is to do little research how particular motor/esc/cells perform (data as eff, rpm, losses, overall eff., etc). It takes few minutes to play and adjust prop sizes, pitch and step, but it soons becomes childs play.

If anyone is interested I made excell spreadsheet script for cars (VERY BASIC motor/cells/esc simulation and taking account gearing/tire size to give speed). But it doesn't do any simulation for real you just see/predict how fast car can go on given amp load.

One more off topic from cars:

Today my friend tried his very custom made rewound, epoxy balanced, timed 400 6 V motor in his 8 cell 1000 mAh AA NiCd micro unlimited shovelnose. Man, this thing was fast! As fast if not faster than same setup with 480 BB race!!! But of course, efficiency of 400 motor is not so good and comm need to be skimmed after two runs.

Here is the vid:
http://modelarji.kelt.si/upload/mapa...aturbomini.WMV

I think micro RS4 should do twice that speed on terra firma and four tires. You can take my word.

Last edited by Miha Holc; 10-31-2002 at 01:06 PM.
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  #29  
Old 10-31-2002, 01:12 PM
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Miha Holc Miha Holc is offline
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Oh, one more note about that custom rewound 400... he says it behaves like 4.8 V race but has more torque and better efficiency. He uses thicker wire to rewound and winds it as much as he can. He said 17 turns compared to 35 turns on 6 V. 4.8 V race has 20 turns but I think the windings are far from perfect tight wound.
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  #30  
Old 10-31-2002, 02:53 PM
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Jaminak Jaminak is offline
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That boat seemed insanley fast. I wish there was a body of water big enough around here to try out a boat. I can't believe you guys have micros that are going THAT fast. I guess I'll have to stop being the friend that is "happy with his stocker" and get into the super fast scene.
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